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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey guys ! ! ! ! ! !

I was able to PROOVE another one of my theories today that the size 6s Elgin military dial does in FACT exist ! ! ! ! !

The clues were all around me like the size 6s Philadelphia trench watch cases and a pair of size 6s Elgin military hands that I found a few months ago.

BUT ! ! ! ! Where are all of the size 6s Elgin military dials ? ? ? ? ? ? ?

I was starting to think that these watches just perhaps used a regular Roman numeral or Arabic numeral dials.

I have NOT ever seen a size 6s American military trench watch dial, UNTIL TODAY ! ! ! ! ! !

Trust me, I have searched through hell and high water for the past couple of years but over the weekend I found one ! ! ! ! !

FINALLY ! ! ! ! !

And here is the kicker, IT'S DATE STAMPED ON THE BACK OF THE DIAL ! ! ! !

I haven't even seen a picture of one, ANYWHERE ! ! ! ! !

It still had some of the original factory lum on the dial and on the hands.



The date stamp on the back of the dial: "8. 18" is for August 1918 ! ! ! ! !



Take a look at the size 6s hands, they were in pretty bad condition.



This is after the dial had been cleaned up, no ultrasonic, only cleaned by hand so the date stamp does not get removed ! ! !



The dial on the left is the size 6s, the dial on the right is the common size 3/0s that we see all of the time.

The size 6s dwarfs the size 3/0s, it's just huge ! ! ! ! ! !



The dial and hands were assembled to an Elgin size 6s movement dating back to 1918, serial number 21386442, making it a PERFECT MATCH ! ! ! !

Soon as it arrived I completely broke the movement down for a cleaning and a new mainspring.



I polished the inside of every last metal bushing, if you're going to do something do it right ! ! !



The inside of the bushings were very dirty, the polinum/oil mixture turned black on the toothpick but they are all now VERY CLEAN ! ! !



A picture of the 7 jewel 1918 movement once re-assembled, very good looking movement ! ! ! ! !



And now some pictures of the fully assembled trench watch.

Take a look at the minute hand, see how flared the end of the hand is ? ? ?

How cool is that ? ! ? ! ? !











The movement is set inside a Philadelphia SILVERODE case that measures 41mm lug to lug and 38mm without the crown, 16mm lugs.

I can't even begin to tell you guys how truly rare this Elgin Trench Watch is, it probably belongs in a museum ! ! ! !

PLUS, the dial does not have any hairlines and it's date stamped ! ! ! ! ! ! !

I just keep staring at it ! ! ! !

I hope that you guys enjoyed this thread, this really is a GRAIL WATCH ! ! ! ! !

IT DOES EXIST ! ! ! ! !

I'll post some nice wrist shots in the morning when the light is much better.

Now it's time for a cocktail !
 

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Stan!!!

You are incredible with your passion. I admire it.

That is a beautiful one and I hope it is yours NFS.


I need you to answer a question of mine and Doug's on my "Day/Nite" thread. Doug had some questions about the movement in the Elgin.

/thread jack

But yeah... Magnificent!!!
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thanks ! ! !

Now that I know this one exists I am seriously wondering if they made this military 6s dial with a RED 12 variation ? ? ? ? ?

I know that they made one with a bold Roman numeral RED XII dial in a 6s because I have one ! ! ! ! !
 

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Another fantastic trip through the horological forest...
What a cool find, Stan and a very interesting discovery.

I know I will hear the yelling from Illinois to NY when you find
the magical "Red 12" version!:laugh:
G
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 · (Edited)
I just LOVE the morning light in my front room ! ! !

I really wonder why Elgin did not put pictures/drawings of their military dials in the material catalogs?

All of the other dials are in the books but the military dials are missing for some odd reason (including the Pershing Dial) ! ! !

I know that these regular style military dials were available starting in 1914/1915 but they are NOT in the 1915 Elgin Material Catalog or thereafter.

I THINK that Elgin started making Arabic RED 12 dials in 1912 but this theory can't be proven right now.

I THINK that they started making the Military RED 12 dials around 1915 but once again I can't prove this just yet.

Pretty much all of the RED 12, RED XII dials were made for the European/Australian/Canadian markets.

The far more desirable versions have the "MADE IN USA" stamp just above the second hand or just below the ELGIN dial signature.

Maybe I will have to write that book someday ! ! ! !

I just need to prove more of these mysteries ! ! ! ! !
























 

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Super cool! It is so satisfying when you solve a mystery, big or small! :thumbup1:
 
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Some sweet pics. :thumbup1:
 

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:w00t:....That is some watch you re-did there Stan ......as usual ......I just can't get blase about the watches you re-do though ....every one of them is so pristine when you finish them .....

I am however, running out of words to say how much I like them and admire them ......oh well, just have to re-use some of those words .....

and to solve a mystery too.......yep.....and the best part is that you're young , and have plenty of time to continue to solve more mysteries .....then ......when you have reached the point of amassing an almost unmanagable amount of information ......sit down and write that book ,..,..( well illustrated of course )


you'll never run out of mysteries to solve with the subject .....but you'll surely have enough info to justify a book.....


and speaking of books......I would love to see you write one, with all the wonderful photos and information you set out here.....you could almost just go through your threads and pull out the info directly.....and it might be cool to have some of the replies included when applicable .......


I think, the way you work, that any book you write would set a new bar for watch books.......


I have been a book fiend my whole life .....and frankly, I have yet to meet a watch book that I could say ....now here's a great book ......I have only seen the 35 or so books I have ...and all of them are a waste of time .....I get more and better information from you guys here than entire books I have ......


thanks for this thread too Jeff......and you know what I really liked ? ....was the part with showing the toothpick cleaning out the inside of those holes.......I can relate to that kind of attention to detail.....
 
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