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Lets see your white dialed Astronauts.

4K views 43 replies 11 participants last post by  Stu3 
#1 ·
I recently picked up a white dialed Astro. From the pics I thought it was a silver dial one, but when it showed up, it turned out to be a white dial M9 type 1 US spec. My first thought was that it was a really bad redial, but then I looked closely at the font on the dial and saw that it matched my m5 black dial Astro, so likely not a redial. I did some more digging and found one other copy of a white dial but its an enhanced one, from 1968, so same time period as mine.

Clearly these are uncommon.
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Will
 
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#2 ·
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I recently picked up a white dialed Astro. From the pics I thought it was a silver dial one, but when it showed up, it turned out to be a white dial M9 type 1 US spec. My first thought was that it was a really bad redial, but then I looked closely at the font on the dial and saw that it matched my m5 black dial Astro, so likely not a redial. I did some more digging and found one other copy of a white dial but its an enhanced one, from 1968, so same time period as mine.

Clearly these are uncommon.
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Will
 
#3 · (Edited)
Interesting pair of Astro's. The Astro "B" since it has a Coffin Link on it in the ad would be a watch sold before 1965(Hence the early Letter designation). They phased out Coffin Links for the Bullet Band around that time. M9 would not put your watch in the category of an Astro "B" and also that Astro B is a simple silver Dial with no lume dots on the 1/2 hour marks. Yours has 1/2 hour lume dots, just like the black dial next to it.

Also that Black Dial Astro you have has a Swiss 24 Hour GMT Bezel on it which would not be found on a known USA Black dial Astro. Note both the Bezels you are showing are completely different font designs.

Simple Silver Astro "B" Dial:
 
#4 ·
The black Astro is original. Its a 339, no prefix 6 digit swiss case with the large date code. The dial says T-swiss-T on the front at the bottom, and on the back is printed SWISS. Yes, it is different in that it says Bulova Accutron at the top, as the swiss black dial versions do. The white one is the US watch. The dial paint matches the same sheen as the black dial, almost like a lacquer finish. The serial number for the white dial one is G40821 the inside of the caseback does not have any number printed on it, just the instructions on how to remove the GMT dial and crystal. (Unlike the black one that has 339 printed on it, but no instructions. Here is the case back for the black one.
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Will
 
#6 ·
The black dial one is rare as SM2 says. You normally see a mish mash of USA and swiss parts for them. To see one with the right model numbers in the caseback is a home run. The lume for these variants seems to change a lot. I posted lots of pictures I found of the "swiss marked" variants in the astro reference thread.

As far as the white dial goes, my opinion is that it is a redial. The "accutron" text seems off. The triangle markers are different as well. Reply with some higher resolution pictures and I can help compare it to other high-res dial pictures I have if you want confirmation. You don't see the white/cream/silver dials with dots on the dial unless it is one of the rare swiss marked variants. For comparisons sake, here is a side by side with one of those swiss variants since all the USA simple silvers do not have dots:

Clock Font Measuring instrument Material property Wood
 
#7 · (Edited)
This interesting to me... Was this watch dial a factory dial/option or an aftermarket redial thing. I bought the one that was on Pikers webiste and sent it back for the obvious flaw on the dial and fact that it was not running properly from when I opened the package. Note that the "Accutron" is applied and not printed. He offered to have it re-dialed but after two months of waiting, i asked for and thankfully got a full refund after he said the re-dial company was not responding. This was last March/April so who knows what is going on now. It is still for sale on his website and showing the pic from when I bought it. Pic I posted is mine and not sure if you can see the obvious flaw on the dial. Sadly, I think the white dial is cool and different and I was sad to see it go back but the fact that it was so obviously flawed prior to payment and shipping and that it failed to keep time the day I got it pissed me off.
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#8 ·
??????????? C'mon guys...surely someone has an opinion this question of white dial Astros? Factory dial? I checked the sticky notes on here on the Astro section and do not see any mention of a white (ie enamel) dial Astro as a standard offering. Limited edition? The two pics on this thread look like it would have to have been applied before lume and letterring etc. Not sure if you could take a completed dial and paint/bake it to make it white like either of the two shown here.
 
#9 ·
I should have more info on mine shortly. I was looking at the one that you had on Piker's site and that is what got me thinking mine might be an original. I haven't found any proof they were released from the factory, but like my black Swiss type 1 above, the fact that there are some Astro variants that haven't been seen before are still out there. At this point however, I can't say one way or another.
 
#11 ·
LOL.... True dat... Putting that aside, we now have evidence of at least two "white astros" and it would be interesting to see if the hive mind can crack the code and we can learn how they came into being. The one that I had from Piker for 3 days (before I sent it back) was pretty to look at except for a large and visible to the naked eye area where the white material had cracked and lifted off the dial (sort of pie shape). It had the look of a backed on enamel or possibly paint. Other than that flaw, it looked very much like something you would see from the factory. Although I guess it is possible it was something that was done after it left the factory in the same way a watch gets re-dialed and re-lumed by a skilled craftsman.
 
#12 ·
Both my black and white dial have a glossy finish that looks like a baked on enamel. To go a step further, on the white one, the finish and color looks just like my canadian dress RR dial (hidden spaceview since it doesn't say railroad approved.)

To argue on the side of mine being a factory watch even though the hour markers are a little off, I'd have to guess Bulova had several dial manufacturers, perhaps the white dial ones were a trial run from a different manufacturer, where only a few were made and then the idea was abandoned? Or, perhaps it was a factory error that slipped through. Hopefully in the next week or so I'll have more clarification once it comes apart.
 
#13 ·
It's sort of like seeing an albino squirrel. They exist, but are rare. Maybe it is just a squirrel that just ran through a paint booth. You just don't know for sure.

Anyways, as far as a white astro dial goes... I have saved many tons of photos of astro watches. I haven't seen a legit "white" dial. Re-dial companies will do pretty much anything you want including changing the dial color. Some people even do those fancy cut-out spaceview astro dials. If you like how it looks, then why does it matter? The sticky post shows a description of the "simple silver" dial as being "white" but it does not actually look white at all and that variant doesn't have dots on the dial. There are plenty of anomalies that the variant matrix doesn't list, but the matrix is intended to show variants that have advertisements or other bulova documentation. I think it is a stretch to argue about dial manufacture differences in the marker design since there is a large number of reference photos to look at on google.
 
#16 ·
Given that I have seen some pretty incredible dial restorations that returned old and beat to crap (sunken wreck in some cases) dials to NIB condition, I guess it would be possible for someone to take an old dial (or a new one) and change the dial from black to white using the same technique as you would for any white dial (ie RR) and make a white Astro.
 
#20 ·
My watchmaker hasn't had a chance to look at mine yet. I'll update as soon as I know something.

I don't see why you couldn't paint a black or silver dial white, but with the black dials, painting them white would require either some seriously heavy pigmented paint, or multiple coats of paint to cover the black. From what I've found with white paint, when you paint over black, you end up with a grey look to the dial. Mine is not grey, but white. I'd think it would be easier to strip it and start from scratch.
 
#22 ·
He made a good point about trying to re-dial a black one....You'd have to get the black finish/paint off to get to pure white like ones in question. I wonder if maybe they were a limited run from the factory? I also note that the two examples we know of in this puzzle are a basic dial and an enhanced dial (ie the one from Piker's site). I guess that might be a possibility right? They took a few hundred Astro dials (in the white) and made them "white" like a RR and then assembled them into "white astros". Not to confuse a "white astro" with a blonde Swiss Type 4. I have a Swiss Type 4 Blonde and it is most certainly not white - even though sometimes people call it a Swiss T4 White dial. Paging Rob B to the courtesy phone...
 
#25 ·
There may be another white dialed on on ebay right now. I messaged the seller asking if it was indeed a white dial with discoloration or a silver dial with discoloration. I haven't heard back yet.

This does seem to have the narrower lume markers like mine, but again, not sure if its actually a white dial or not.
 
#27 ·
Without really high resolution pictures, it's hard to say if something is camera distortion or if it is just a redial job. My vote is unchanged that it is a redial. The accutron text on his white dial sits too low on the dial. His text sits on what would be the second line of a "bulova accutron" labeled dial. The triangles are not the same to my eye. The astronaut text looks decent, but the "A" letters look a little off to me. I have stared at this dial a lot as it is is an interesting topic and I hope other examples come up.

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#28 · (Edited)
Without some sort of connecting the dots research or actual comparison documentation and very detailed pics, beyond saying yes it does or no it doesn't, the whole conversation is 'speculation'. Aside from a few Swiss dials that obviously matched up well with Swiss movements and Swiss Bezel rings, I don't see how you can use those few Europe based oddities to try to tie them to any USA dials that may look similar. Facts!!!!!!! Not maybes!!! That's how folklore one of a kind watches become real. Talk about it enough, people start believing it's real.
 
#29 ·
Can we see more examples of redials? Known examples, for instance? I see a difference in the “C” in Accutron and the slant of the “A” in Astronaut. So that make me wonder who uses similar fonts. Of course, that doesn’t exclude an older redial, or one from an unknown purveyor, but it might answer the question about similar dials.


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